Satanicviews comment
A representative of the Order of Nine Angles (ONA) has responded to our recent Satanicviews blog post about them via one of their blogging sites, and confirms that they are not Satanists. The article is as below:
As the ONA confirm they are not Satanists, a confirmation that can be found in various other ONA sources as well, it becomes unnecessary for us to offer arguments that ONA are not Satanists, though we still plan such arguments to deal with Reverse Christianity. We offer their full article as below, link as per above, under the Creative Commons (CC) copyright license which the ONA tend to ascribe to in the distribution of their information. We will respond to issues raised in that ONA article in a future post.
ONA article in response to Satanicviews
Recently, We came across an article (Is ONA and RC Satanism?) written by the mundane Satanist who already wrote a couple of articles regarding ONA on previous occasions – like, for example, that one about nonsense such as “disbanding ONA” etc. This nonsense was well enough addressed by some other people, back then. Now, the author, seems to be accepting their previous nonsense about “disbanding” ONA as the nonsense it was/is, because they treat ONA as still existing, being that they argue about/with it.
What fascinates Us, over and over again, when We read stuff like these, is the fact how shallow mundanes are and how they are incapable of grasping anything ONA – sometimes trying very hard to squeeze it into their narrow views, into their little black and white worlds. Also, We believe how they never bother to read numerous ONA writings dealing with, and explaining their usual misconceptions. Article in question is filled with these usual misconceptions and gives away very uninformed view of the Order of Nine Angles (like previous “disbanding” nonsense wasn’t good enough clue). This implies that the author either never honestly studied ONA (which takes some effort and time), or they simply lack any intellectual and emphatic skills to successfully fulfill such a task, as it is the case with the most mundanes.
We have no illusions that We will ever enlighten one of these characters by writing “responses” such as this one, so this is in no way serious attempt of arguing them or refuting some of their claims – it mainly serves as an example (amusing one) for those who are honestly interested in ONA – an example of how blind and clueless mundanes are. What is especially discouraging in this case is the fact that comparing ONA with, and leveling it down to RC (reverse Christianity) is even greater misconception than previous “disbanding” nonsense. To be honest, some forms used by ONA, as presented in Black Book of Satan and similar works may look like something comparable with RC. However, these are only “forms” – not the ONA itself. Practical and esoteric meanings and purpose of these forms were elaborated in different writings of the Order and its affiliates, many, many times. But, as we already mentioned, these Satanist are not even reading such material and/or are incapable of grasping it. There is one thing about which author of the article in question is right: ONA is not Satanism, or more precisely, ONA is not just Satanism:
The Order of Nine Angles (O9A, ONA) is a sinisterly-numinous mystic tradition: it is not now and never was either strictly satanist or strictly Left Hand Path, but uses ‘satanism’ and the LHP as ‘causal forms’; that is, as techniques/experiences/ordeals/challenges (amoral and otherwise) in a decades-long personal anados to engender in the initiate both esoteric, and exoteric, pathei mathos, and which pathei mathos is the beginning of wisdom. – O9A 101, Sinisterly-Numinous Tradition
Let us examine some of the statements written in this article from satanicviews blog:
The ONA is a philosophy invented by David Myatt in the 1970’s who synthesized his white supremacist and occult interests into a worldview that has been extensively added to by himself and his followers.
If nothing else this is oversimplifying of origins and history, and very nature of ONA. According to Order’s own writings ONA IS philosophy, but philosophy of Anton Long. Now, those Satanist would instantly try to simplify this one as well by asserting how Anton Long is actually David Myatt. Well, Anton Long is not, nor he ever was a real person. From one perspective it is just a nym, evidently used by various people over decades – as suggested by some academics and some ONA adherents (and even some Satanist). It was certainly used by Richard Moult, Chloe Ortega, Richard Stirling and other individuals. From this perspective Anton Long is some sort of fictional character (this, again being oversimplifying, of course) whose traits and life story are compiled by bits of traits and lives of all the people who ever animated this character, who ever acted as him, plus some additional necessities required for such a creation. From yet another perspective, Anton Long is a Myth, archetypal figure, a magickal tool/ being, with certain functions and purposes. ONA is philosophy of Anton Long – this means that, if we want to tie this philosophy and this name with any real person, we don’t have to tie it exclusively with Myatt, we can also say that ONA is a philosophy of Richard Moult, or Chloe Ortega, or anyone else who acted as Anton Long or helped with building of this character in some other way. We will not weight amount or quality of these influences – we are just saying that there never was only one real person behind Anton Long and his philosophy. This is one of the reasons why David Myatt always was, and still is able to claim that he is not Anton Long.
For long time now David Myatt has his own philosophy through which he mostly rejected his “white supermacist (again, very uninformed view of Myatt’s interpretation of National-Socialism) and occult interests”. Not only this – he also wrote in very insightful (thus honest) way about why and how he rejected his previous views and ideas, creating very personal philosophy which needs no body of followers in any way. Even if we assume, as it is widely accepted, that David Myatt was original animator behind Anton Long, we cannot say that the two are the same. One is a real person, human being – the other … a being of some other kind.
The ONA is largely an incoherent, impractical and rambling philosophy full of hocus pocus and pseudo philosophical ideology with a strong focus of incitement to killing people, specifically their obsession with culling and human sacrifice.
“Incoherent” in this case simply means too complex and incomprehensible for the mind and soul of mundane Satanist. They see this philosophy as “incoherent”, contradictory and what else not, only because it is non-linear and is not depending upon anything which common mundane can put in some tiny box of their “understanding” and stick a label to it. The fact is that their limitations are not allowing them to see the the big picture, so they perceive just bits and pieces of ONA, here and there, thus experiencing it as “incoherent”. Yes, We know that when they characterize ONA in this way, they are simply irritated by its elusiveness. Also, apparent incoherence and/or contradictions serve certain purposes, of which some are practical and others esoteric. You need a honest effort to put pieces together, to connect dots into coherent picture. This also being a part of the Way and of the process of learning.
We wonder what “Impractical” exactly means here? It is well known that entire ONA philosophy is very practical and oriented towards very practical action, deeds and goals. We remember another mundane Satanist writing about how he believes ONA is not real, simply because it expects from its adherents fulfillment of tasks fitting for Hercules. We imagine this Satanist being some obese, pimple-covered, American to whom climbing up the stairs seems to be a job for Hercules. If you ever read about physical requirements and training routines of some military special forces, you’ll realize that ONA tasks are child’s play in comparison to those. Some ONA tasks may look extremely difficult and impractical only to extremely weak, indulging Satanist who are often incapable of being functional and practical in their everyday mundane lives. Besides physical tasks what else one might find impossible or impractical? Grade rituals which demands no special requirements, items, ceremonies, formulas, or anything except your strong will to endure them? Insight Roles? Self-honesty (this one is probably very impractical for mundane Satanist)? Discipline (again, very impractical for this indulgent kind)? Culling (as well, so impractical for these obedient sheeple)? What?
When they say “impractical” they probably mean – hard, dangerous, risky, something which implies moving out of their comfort zone and/or shattering of their illusions about the world, endangering their safety. We guess that some of them, being occult fetishists they are, deem as “practical” some old-aeon fantasy systems, or some dusty grimoires with formulas requiring a hair from cross-eyed rabbit whose mother was eaten by the limping wolf at specific time of a year. At least you never hear them criticizing such nonsense this loudly. You never hear them criticizing deluded JoS kids who are killing Jehowa’s angels and making love with their demons every day, and what else not. They will accept them as Satanist. But they will always criticize ONA. Why? – Because they feel threatened. Although ONA is not, nor it ever was strictly Satanic – it actually embodies the very essence of what Satan is, as well as it puts Satanism into proper practical and esoteric context. All of this threatens mundane Satanist because it simply shakes and erode their safe fantasy game, it reveals lies they are convincing each others of, and reveals them for being sheeple they are.
Due to its incoherence and impracticality the ONA is unable to survive in its own right as a philosophy, so survives as like a parasite, trying to incorporate itself into hosts such as religions and political movements, but always with the clear agenda of inciting harm to life and property.
(More precise description of ONA would be a “virus” – highly adaptable, shape-shifting virus) At this point We realized that we are dealing with probably the most uninformed view of ONA out there (and which is, sadly even applauded by a number of sheeple disguised as Satanist).
Anyone who posses some esoteric understanding and some Aeonic perspective, should understand manipulation of religious, political, occult and art forms in context. Besides this, ONA possess that unbounded essence which can survive and live and be expressed through any form, already existent, or the new ones created. It can also survive with almost no form, wordless, shapeless, but simply Known and lived by some. Where would be any other group/philosophy/order/ religion without their strictly defined set of rules and forms? ONA adherent can be literally anything outwardly – they can be Buddhist, Muslim, Christian, Satanist, Pagan, Atheist, whatever you think of… but still they’ll be ONA. Can you claim this about anything else out there? Any strain of Satanism or some other philosophy/ religion/(sub-)culture? Same as an individual adherent is using such religious, political, occult and art forms for the sake of their own development, for the deepening of their insights and furthering of their own goals, through manipulation of such forms – ONA uses these forms for her own development and for the furthering of Aeonic goals. ONA doesn’t depend upon these forms and can change them as one changes their clothes. The person wearing different clothes is the same person, like the ONA is the same (some)thing under different guises. This simplicity is not understood by mundane Satanist and similar species, as they actually depend upon outer forms very much, and the very identity of the most of them depends even upon the clothes they are wearing. If they are not wearing black, or some satanic jewelry, or some satanic tattoo, their “satanism” will be suspicious. And this is the case with any religion/movement/(sub-)culture out there. Slaves of forms…
The ONA however had some success with Satanism, and convinced many Satanists for a while that ONA was a form of Satanism.
ONA, actually never tried to convince anyone that it is a form of Satanism. But We think this one is clear from what was written here previously, and elsewhere over the years. ONA just uses Satanism as a form. There is a difference. However, ONA IS Presencing of Satan, even if this is not exclusively accomplished through forms of Satanism as such.
Satanicviews in future blog posts will offer several objective arguments which will clearly show that Reverse Christianity and the Order Nine Angles has never been and will never be Satanism
Why bothering with providing arguments for the claim that ONA is not and has never been “Satanism”, if Order itself clearly supports this fact? This Satanist in his article even writes: “As ONA adherents freely admit ONA is not Satanism (…)”(??). Again, why bothering with this then? They can simply copy that quote from O9A 101 we provided here and they can rest their case. Every time when something like this surface up, We wonder – “How dumb they really are?”.
Finally, if ONA, in their opinion, is akin to Reverse Christianity, what’s about those mundane Satanist who writes dumb stuff like this latest article on satanicviews? What about their law-abiding-love -your -neighbor -and- his- property – Satanism? Is it not akin to Christianity itself? This type of Magian-muppet Satanism was well characterized in many ONA writings, such is the one provided here for the further reading (i.e. “A Heretical Satanism” as a part of influence-innovation compilation).
Fear not, dear dumb Satanist. ONA doesn’t want to take your mundane satanism from you. ONA doesn’t need your mundane satanism, nor it’s trying to fit into it, or to dominate it, or whatever you might be thinking it’s doing. And, again – you don’t even have to prove how ONA is not Satanism. Admittedly it is not. Just cool down and learn to make, and appreciate some subtle differences: ONA is not Satanism – but there IS ONA Satanism. ONA is not Satanism – but it IS and it has been, and it will be Presencing of Satan.
Zorya
und
Gnawers
Further Reading:
Occultism, National-Socialism and ONA
The Esoteric philosophy of the Order of Nine Angles, Introduciton
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